Colin Take the very small "Apistogramma" Mutlifasciatus 8-) out of the parent tank when you see some..... raise them seperate and then you will see more males as they grow up.... the large adult male must be killing off the rival males...... which is normally strange.... i did them in a 15 gallon tank with about 40 shells and i normally had several small breeding groups inside that 15 gallon tank..... several males with lots of females.... This is how i did them..... John "who dont keep any rift lake stuff" ... yeah Right... lol ----------------------------------------------------------------------- -- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com. apisto-digest@listbox.com also available. Web archives at http://lists.thekrib.com/apisto Trading at http://blox.dropship.org/mailman/listinfo/apisto_trader