Re: [GSAS-Member] Arapaima

["Hess, Clay A" <clay.a.hess@boeing.com>]

How is ethical defined?   Where is this line drawn?  
Clay Hess
787 Fuselage Systems Integration Manager and Team Leader
425-931-4322

----- Original Message -----
From: gsas-member-bounces@thekrib.com <gsas-member-bounces@thekrib.com>
To: Greater Seattle Aquarium Society member chat <gsas-member@thekrib.com>
Sent: Tue Jan 12 10:21:40 2010
Subject: Re: [GSAS-Member] Arapaima


While I totally agree with all of your points about the unethical nature
of keeping a specimen you can't possibly hope to raise to maturity (I
think they can actually go well over 6 feet), I was just answering the
posed question regarding where someone with a huge tank would get them--
probably any run of the mill local fish shop...

Just to clarify my understanding of the legality (and yes, I've seen
numerous illegal species for sale in local shops, some of which were quite
cheap and quite dangerous! Know your saltwater species before you buy!), I
thought CITES II just meant you needed an export certificate for the
specimen (within the quota counts), but that no import certificate was
needed.  So if the animal came with no certificate, it would be illegal
for them to export it, but it's still completely legal (although still
unethical at several levels) to buy it at the pet store.

Is that wrong?



>
>
>
>> Message: 11
>> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 22:31:56 -0800 (PST)
>> From: "Clifford Miller" <clifford@clevergeek.com>
>> To: "Greater Seattle Aquarium Society member chat"
>> <gsas-member@thekrib.com>
>> Subject: Re: [GSAS-Member] Largest home aquarium (Susan Welenofsky)
>> Message-ID: <49635.98.203.222.203.1263277916.squirrel@clevergeek.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>>
>>
>> I missed the original post, but thought I'd chime in to say I've seen
>> juvie Arapima for sale in the Seattle area several times in the last
>> year
>> in the sub $200 range. I'm not sure what the current legal status is,
>> but
>> they definitely show up and aren't hard to find.
>>
>> Cliff
>>
>
>
> They're CITES listed, in fact on the Red list (in 2000):
> http://www.cites.org/eng/resources/species.html as threatened
>
>
>
> Just because something's available in a pet shop doesn't mean it's
>
> 1) legal to keep
>
> 2) ethical to keep or
>
> 3) reasonable to keep - Arapaima properly kept get *huge*.  These things
> get to be 6 feet long!
>
>
>
>
>
> Consider that Arapaima aren't bred in captivity, the best thing you can do
> is just keep on walking past when you see some in a shop, and consider
> patronizing other shops that are more ethical.
>
>
>
> Shops won't sell them if people don't buy them. Don't buy them. Buy some
> big cichlids, they're way more interesting and easier to keep. Participate
> in things like Victorian cichlid conservation, the fish (well, some of
> 'em) are very attractive. Likewise, Madagascar cichlids are being kept in
> captivity quite well and are very interesting and some, esp. the Dambas,
> quite attractive looking.
>
>
>
> I've seen them for years available in pet shops around the country. Juvies
> as you point out are kind of small-ish and your average pet shop customer
> is not too well informed
>
>
>
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