Re: AGA - Digest V1 #153

["Jim Capelle" <JCapelle@email.msn.com>]

I see here a real need to let communication flow both ways.
    The Founding Fathers and Mothers should tell the future judges what they
were thinking of when they set up "Criteria" and any other Gray terms that
will be left up to the judges of future days, who may have to get some
wording clarify later.  A judge may have to ask a question when one of the
founding Parent's own tank is involved in the group being judged.  The tank
I mentioned earlier this week that was a true Bio- set up of native fish and
plants to FL, was my tank and I just happen to be Show Chairperson that
year, I had backed away and let the other committee members work on that one
without me being near them, I lost.
    As to having comments made by the judges on the entries, I personnel
think it's great and I ve seen it work to make an Aquarium Beautiful Show
grow and get better.  When a local club held it's first AB show, two of the
best looking tanks got disqualify in the first minute of judging, due to the
tank's backs were not painted black.  Now the judges had an open hand on how
to judge, they used the rules from the FL State Fair AB show and a painted
(solid color I believe) background was one of the rules.  It didn't matter
that the two tanks held the attention of anyone who walked near, but it was
a rule that once everyone found out from the judges what happened, all the
club members painted the backs of their show tanks, even if you couldn't see
it unless you got behind the tank to see if it was painted or not.
        Knowing what makes a tank win or lose will help in the show to get
better, as the players learn from someone's mistake or what they did right.
They will try to be better next time.
     On the same idea I believe all the tanks (when possible) should be
posted on the internet or what ever media is used.  This also would help
some people who do not get a lot exposure to many tanks set-ups, to see what
others are or can do.  Over the years I have seen many great idea makers on
the internet.  Why would anyone hold back on letting everyone see their
entry?  Unless there is a reason for not let anyone see it.  One could be
entering someone else's tank or a picture from a local pet store.  Read the
back of most states lottery tickets about using your face and name if you
win.  Yes it reads any winnings that means $1.00 too.  Does Canada have a
lottery?
    As to back firing I do not see much of that happening if everything is
up front on the application.  One why to save someone's face from perceived
shame.  would hold back the name of the tank owner from bottom end (I will
not use losers, as anyone who enters is a winner just for trying)  Have a
block to check off; "If your tank is on the bottom (or loser~(:>))we will
show a picture of it.  Can we still use your name?"  something like that,
but show the tank so people will learn what will kill them next time if they
try that type of set-up.
    As to Ken's comment about keeping the negative comments low.  I think
yes and no.  To tear (I hate using that word around planted tanks) into one
tank that lost and not mention anything about the other ones that lost,
would be wrong.  I myself have had many learning points on hearing why
someone's system worked or didn't work over the years.  Like; "your sand
settled from your plants roots exposing them", or "that Aluminum plant looks
good but in never grows in water", and I as said the painted backgrounds
showed me a lot.  I could see someone losing and not hearing anything about
why and feeling real bad and not entering again.  If they know up front,
there will a critique by the judges, what can they say?   They could just be
general the high points and low points, or if entries and time allow they
could go into great detail.


>From: "James Purchase" <jpurch@interlog.com>
>Subject: Criteria, Judging & Privacy
>
>While we await any further input on the "weighting" of the Criteria, two
>things need to be decided.
>
>1. Do we leave the Criteria stand alone, by themselves (just the words), or
>do we attach brief, descriptive sentences or a paragraph to each of them,
to
>make certain that the Judges know what we wish considered under each
>Criteria? Earlier, I had given some possibilities which didn't seem to go
>over every well. If anyone familiar with Judging Criteria used in other
>similar venues cares to chime in on this and to possibly give us some
>suggestions, I'd appreciate it.
>

>2. We have discussed at length the pretty wide spread hope that the Judges
>will provide some feedback on the entries which they review. We talked of
>putting these comments on the Web and on the CD-ROM. Jose makes a
convincing
>argument for making this our practice - if folks entering the contest are
>advised in advance that Judges comments are to be made public, and if the
>Judges comments are restricted to the qualities of the specific aquascape I
>can see no problems with privacy.
>
>Any thoughts, yea or nay from anyone else? Does anyone have any concerns
>that this might backfire on us if the comments are negative and/or someone
>takes them the wrong way? If you DO have reservations, please also provide
a
>possible solution if you can think of one.
>
>James Purchase
>

>Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 12:23:39 -0400
>From: "Ken Guin" <kenguin@homemail.com>
>Subject: RE: Criteria, Judging & Privacy
>
>>
>Ken replies: I think we should provide as much detail as possible regarding
>what we mean by such things as color, balance, use of space, use of
>materials, etc. That is not to say that we setup the criteria in such a way
>that WE determine the final out come of the Showcase/Contest. However, we
>should provide enough information to let the judges know what we are
talking
>about. Depending on who the judges are, there will probably be some that
>will need no explanation, but others who won't have a clue as to what
>"viability" means. Besides that, we should have some clear-cut definitions
>so the judging will be as consistent as possible in subsequent years.
>
>Ken replies: I would like to see a block on the entry form giving us
>permission to use the photographs and to publish the judges' comments.
After
>the judging is completed and the results tabulated, we would only publish
>the judges' comments about the winners (maybe the top three in each
>category). I would think that most of the winners would have very few
>"negative" comments about them. By doing this, we can keep the published
>negative comments to a minimum while still providing an opportunity for the
>"viewers" to learn why the judges thought certain entries were the best.
>
>Ken Guin




  ------------------
  To unsubscribe from this list, e-mail majordomo@aquatic-gardeners.org
  with "unsubscribe aga-contest" in the body of the message.
  To subscribe to the digest version, add "subscribe aga-contest-digest"
  in the same message.
  Old messages are available at http://lists.thekrib.com/aga-contest