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Re: MCM - Digest V1 #153
-----Original Message-----
From: MCM - Digest <owner-aga-mcm-digest@thekrib.com>
To: aga-mcm-digest@thekrib.com <aga-mcm-digest@thekrib.com>
Date: Sunday, September 26, 1999 7:16 AM
Subject: MCM - Digest V1 #153
>
>MCM - Digest Sunday, September 26 1999 Volume 01 : Number 153
>
>
>
>In this issue:
>
> PAM & AGA expenses to do newsletter.
> PAM, distribution of stock
> Re: PAM, distribution of stock
> Re: PAM, distribution of stock
>
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>
>Old messages are available at http://lists.thekrib.com/aga-mcm
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 08:53:36 -0400
>From: Neil Frank <nfrank@mindspring.com>
>Subject: PAM & AGA expenses to do newsletter.
>
>>From Bob,
>> One thought not directly pertinent to this discussion is that with the
>>addition of a newsletter, either with TAG or with PAM, our costs will
>>rise and we may have to consider a dues increase to handle it.
>
>Yes. it is probably true that the current 15 dues might not cover the
>expenses after a $12 contribution to PAM. But $3 WILL possibly cover of a 2
>page newsletter. Printing cost 20 cents per issue; first class mail-33
>cents. 53x4= $2.12 for four issues per year (to arrive between a quarterly
>magazine - TAG or PAM)
>
>If we have other expenses that are not offset by our additional revenues
>then we would have to increase dues. DO we have other expenses besides
>publishing and making investments in product which eventually sell?
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 09:45:47 -0400
>From: Neil Frank <nfrank@mindspring.com>
>Subject: PAM, distribution of stock
>
>>From DG:
>>I expect that the getting-started negative cash flow will continue for 6-8
>>quarters. So I will need to take stock (can't get my $20 per hour from
>>cash on hand) for say 8 quarters. If it takes me 75 hours to put together
>>an issue, that is $1500x8=$12K for two years work. If it takes $4K cash
>to cover the negative, then that would give AGA the opportunity to buy me
>out or save its cash until it saw which way the wind was blowing.
>>
>
>I don't understand the above numbers when compared to the projected 2year
>distribution below. I must admit that I was also pleasantly surprised when
>I saw a tangible benefit to my offer to help PAM. This was my first glimpse
>of those numbers. It actually makes me feel a bit uncomfortable to
>participate in a final vote it anyone thinks that my comments or
>recommendations are tainted or in anyway biased. If so, I will gladly
>"recuse" myself. On the other hand, it should not come as a big surprise
>that I would submit an illustrated article or 2 <g>.
>
> Just for imagining's sake, what
>>if two years in we had $16K in stock distributed as follows:
>>
>> $3K AGA startup purchase
>> $3K AGA additional purchases over two years
>> $6K Gomberg
>> $1K Randall (for pics and articles)
>> $2K Frank (for editing)
>>
>>
>
>So if AGA as an organization decided it did not NEED control, is there any
>expectation from PAM that AGA would need to continue pumping in money to
>help cover expenses.
>Dave, can you please construct the worst financial scenario for AGA.
>
>If the mag does well and a profit occurs, is it important for AGA to
>benefit financially. As Lass has said, why is it important for a non-profit
>organization to make money (or can we even invest). I suppose we could fund
>other activities and still stay non-profit, but what are our activites that
>need money that we can't already afford.
>
>Just in case, it would be good if DAVE-G can paint the favorable financial
>forcast.
>
>I assume that if PAM does well and if PAM's unit costs go down, then AGA
>can pay less than $12 per copy? Would the same principle apply if AGA
>membership increases and we are helping supply PAM with customers. (I know,
>it could be symbiotic 'cause AGA could get more members because of PAM)
>After how many copies sold is PAM expected to break even and from there
>where is the profit. Dave, please present the numbers.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 07:36:50 -0700
>From: Dave Gomberg <gomberg@wcf.com>
>Subject: Re: PAM, distribution of stock
>
>Responding to this will take time and I leave for the airport in 30
>minutes. Rather than rush it I will respond when I return. See the word
>"imagining" below. It was intended to describe something NOT REAL. I was
>trying to discuss the issue of control being different from stock ownership
>(look at the names involved).
>
>At 09:45 AM 9/25/1999 -0400, Neil Frank wrote:
>>>From DG:
>>>I expect that the getting-started negative cash flow will continue for
6-8
>>>quarters. So I will need to take stock (can't get my $20 per hour from
>>>cash on hand) for say 8 quarters. If it takes me 75 hours to put
together
>>>an issue, that is $1500x8=$12K for two years work. If it takes $4K cash
>>to cover the negative, then that would give AGA the opportunity to buy me
>>out or save its cash until it saw which way the wind was blowing.
>>>
>>
>>I don't understand the above numbers when compared to the projected 2year
>>distribution below. I must admit that I was also pleasantly surprised when
>>I saw a tangible benefit to my offer to help PAM. This was my first
glimpse
>>of those numbers. It actually makes me feel a bit uncomfortable to
>>participate in a final vote it anyone thinks that my comments or
>>recommendations are tainted or in anyway biased. If so, I will gladly
>>"recuse" myself. On the other hand, it should not come as a big surprise
>>that I would submit an illustrated article or 2 <g>.
>>
>> Just for imagining's sake, what
>>>if two years in we had $16K in stock distributed as follows:
>>>
>>> $3K AGA startup purchase
>>> $3K AGA additional purchases over two years
>>> $6K Gomberg
>>> $1K Randall (for pics and articles)
>>> $2K Frank (for editing)
>>>
>>>
>>
>>So if AGA as an organization decided it did not NEED control, is there any
>>expectation from PAM that AGA would need to continue pumping in money to
>>help cover expenses.
>>Dave, can you please construct the worst financial scenario for AGA.
>>
>>If the mag does well and a profit occurs, is it important for AGA to
>>benefit financially. As Lass has said, why is it important for a
non-profit
>>organization to make money (or can we even invest). I suppose we could
fund
>>other activities and still stay non-profit, but what are our activites
that
>>need money that we can't already afford.
>>
>>Just in case, it would be good if DAVE-G can paint the favorable financial
>>forcast.
>>
>>I assume that if PAM does well and if PAM's unit costs go down, then AGA
>>can pay less than $12 per copy? Would the same principle apply if AGA
>>membership increases and we are helping supply PAM with customers. (I
know,
>>it could be symbiotic 'cause AGA could get more members because of PAM)
>>After how many copies sold is PAM expected to break even and from there
>>where is the profit. Dave, please present the numbers.
>>
>>
>- --
>Dave Gomberg, San Francisco mailto:gomberg@wcf.com
>For low cost CO2 systems that work: http://www.wcf.com/co2iron
>Tropica MasterGrow in the USA: http://www.wcf.com/tropica
>- -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 18:45:53 -0400
>From: krandall@world.std.com
>Subject: Re: PAM, distribution of stock
>
>At 09:45 AM 9/25/99 -0400, Neil Frank wrote:
>
>>It actually makes me feel a bit uncomfortable to
>>participate in a final vote it anyone thinks that my comments or
>>recommendations are tainted or in anyway biased. If so, I will gladly
>>"recuse" myself. On the other hand, it should not come as a big surprise
>>that I would submit an illustrated article or 2 <g>.
>>
>> Just for imagining's sake, what
>>>if two years in we had $16K in stock distributed as follows:
>>>
>>> $3K AGA startup purchase
>>> $3K AGA additional purchases over two years
>>> $6K Gomberg
>>> $1K Randall (for pics and articles)
>>> $2K Frank (for editing)
>
>This is true for me as well. We all know that I write, and I have already
>said I will write for PAM. But I get paid for my articles wherever I sell
>them. I'm not looking toward PAM as a way to boost my income. But as far
>as not voting is concerned, I hope that we _will_ be able to come to a
>concensus, and voting will not be a necessity in any case.
>
>Karen
>
DR I have read and read all this information trying to make sense out of it
all. I asked if we mail ourselves and pay the cost and who is going to look
after the returns and the changes of address on the returned mail, etc. I
have not had an answer yet. If we have to pay postage on top of $12 a copy
we could be broke in no time. Please help me and somebody clarify this.
Dorothy>------------------------------
>End of MCM - Digest V1 #153
>***************************
>