I have to agree with Mike here.... once you start spawning some apistos... you're as much of an expert as anyone else.. Getting apistos to spawn is difficult enough sometimes..... getting them to raise their fry is another thing.... getting those fry to grow up , pair off and reproduce, well you have it down pat at that point. Saying one apisto is easier then another is full of it.... I have difficutly with some of the Simple ones..... example..... Apistogramma Eunotus gives me head aches... I've killed almost as many species as i've successfully spawned. Species like Meinkeni, juruensis, linkei, Geisleri, Pertensis, Sp 4 stripes, hippolytae, iniridae, luelingi, breitbinden.... and some others have all been lost causes in my tanks, and some of these are supposed to be easy...... I cant breed rams to save my life..... get them to spawn, get them to free swimming stage and then time after time after time..... gone!!!! Out of the 24 species i have successfully reproduced over the years.... some "harder" ones have been easy for me.... Nijsenni, Panduro, the ones that like low pH have always done well for me. Guess my point here after rambling is this... with each species you work with you gain valuable information that can be passed on to others.... i learned alot from those species that i ruthlessly killed..... experience gained is knowledge you can pass on to others..... So lets not call ourselves or others "seasoned" breeders..... certainly not "power Breeders"... just some cichlid nuts with some experience. Big " where its gonna snow on sunday" John ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com.