In a message dated 12/01/02 20:21:05 GMT Standard Time, chris@jewell68.freeserve.co.uk writes: > I work on the latin names Microgeophagus Ramirezi and Papiliochromis > altispinosa which was up to date from what I've recently been told. If > anyone has a definative version of what we should call the Bolivian ram I > think it would clear up a lot of confusion, both past and present. I work on Microgeophagus for both species (and the other 'Bolivian Ram' variants). If you have ever seen young Gymnogeophagus balzani or Guianacara geaeyi the relationship between Microgeophagus-Gymnogeophagus-Geophagus is clear. Papillochromis just means 'Butterfly Cichlid' in latin so is not (scientifically) very useful. As far as availability in the UK is concerned - try Peir Aquatics who had some good 'German Strain' fish in (bred in Warrington) or BAS or Tropics of Stockport who often carry wild or near wild Rams - addresses for all in PFK Alan W Alan W ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com.