Mike, I have about 3 tanks of A. cacatuoides now and from the original pair I get double-reds, triple-reds AND orange flash! Many of my females also have lots of reds in their dorsal fins and could easily be mistaken for males. Before you ask, yes I have had fry from them also. Don ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!