just a note here, Francine, you wont have to alter your water for the water changes on your african tanks, i dont do it for mine and they do just fine, and my water is 6.0 pH and 15 ppm out of the tap, just dont do more then 30 % water changes at one time and they wont be affected too badly, mine dont mind it!! John sorry for the african reference here on the pure apisto list lol ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!