The time when I had filamentosa spawn I was amazed because the water near neutral and I was not doing anything to reduce the hardness. However, an interesting point David made is the use of plants. I had the fish in lightly stocked, heavily planted 40 breeder tank. This is the best tank I have ever had for plant growth (CO2 injection) and whenever I would do a water change you could watch streams of O2 bubbles coming from any damaged leaves. Even though I used CO2 whenver I measured the pH it was near 7. I only had 1-2 spawns hatch but every 2 weeks had at least one pair spawn for a long time. Anytime there were eggs they were always on pennywort. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com.