[Chris Jewell] I've recently had problems in the last few months that appear only to be effecting my dwarf cichlids, resulting in the loss of Bolivian rams, Blue rams, Opaline Apistos, Kribs and a few others. It only appears to effect the fish singularly, with one half of a pair being struck down at once, allthough the other can sometimes follow a few days / weeks later. The sysmtoms are the fish become listless, loos colour and generally darken, start to shimmy and stay on the tank bottom. Thsi is followed by heathy breathy, loss of appetite, and death, in about 24-48 hours. [John McCrone] I didn't see any responses to your post. I suspect this is because this is a very puzzling picture. Bolivian rams and Kribs I would consider pretty bullet proof. And if you keep discus successfully, you must have a fair idea of what you are doing. One thought, do the fish that die all come from the same shop? I'm in the UK too and I used to buy at a particular place. Then staff changed and every apisto pair I bought seemed to go black and die after a few days. Not through any obvious disease but simply as if shocked or gill damaged by poor husbandry at the shop. Cheers ------------------------------------------------------------ from John McCrone ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com.