The two ram collecting sites were about 75 kilometers apart, in a straight line. One site was near Piacoa in the southern Orinoco Delta. This was the stream. The stream did not have any plants in the water and the bottom of the stream was a firm sand. The area around the stream was grass and thorny bushes that hung over the stream. The rams were large, about 2+ inches and very colorful. Intense reds and blues with long black lappets from the front of the dorsal fin. Along with the rams we caught A. hoignei, leaf fish, and some sort of eel. The second site was a man made watering pond, I think for livestock. There was no shade and the surrounding vegetation was short dried grass. The pond was shallow with lots of cabomba-type vegetation matting over the water. There were many rams but no other fish. These rams were smaller, less than an inch but were very intense colored. The females had lots of gold speckels on the sides. No extended lappets. All these fish had hollowed bellies. Rams did not travel as well as the various apistos. Got a few home but they did not last long. Tom ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com.