Tim, This fish belongs to the brevis-group, but is not A. brevis. Your fish seems to have highly extended, highly serrated, dorsal fin lappets. A. brevis doesn't show extended lappets or a serrated dorsal fin. Your fish doesn't have a caudal spot. A. brevis does. The Japanese web site Rayon Vert Aqua has photos of young A. brevis that haven't developed a lyretail. Koslowski pictures a mature male in his new book that has a lyretail. The photos in Römer's Atlas that are listed as A. brevis are not this species. These are of fish closely related to A. personata, if not actually personata. Koslowski writes that there are actually 2 species represented in the type material listed in the original description of A. brevis. The holotype of A. brevis the a moderate size fish from the Rio Uaupés, the same as above. Paratypes from the Rio Tiquié are actually a dwarf relative of A. brevis introduced by Römer as A. sp. Tiquié 1. Now let's see if we can ID your fish. Your fish appear to have a moderately elongate, moderately deep, laterally compressed body form. They also show light scales with dark scale edges. The lateral band is moderately broad. the dorsal fin has extended & serrated dorsal fin lappets. The caudal fin is lyrate. This combination of features is found on the typical (but not all) brevis-group species. Looking at the shape of the caudal (lyrate), shape of the dorsal (highly extended, fully serrated, lappets), comparatively short dorsal & anal fin soft ray extensions, broad lateral band ending in the caudal peduncle without a noticeable caudal spot, a bicolor caudal fin, & broad suborbital (cheek) stripe all point to the fish being A. sp. Breitbinden, or something closely related to it. Koslowski pictures a second Breitbinden species coming from around São Gabriel, Brazil, but your photos don't show the dark caudal peduncle patch found on this species. Only 2 other known brevis-group species lack a caudal spot: A. arua & A. sp. Mouthbrooder/Maulbrüter. A. arua doesn't have the bicolor caudal fin & its dark markings & dorsal fin are different. A. sp. Mouthbrooder/Maulbrüter has a similar shape and caudal fin, but the dorsal fin is much lower & its head much larger. Your photos aren't the best for ID purposes, but most features point to a form of A. sp. Breitbinden that isn't exactly like those typically seen. Hope this helps. Mike Wise Tim Ellis wrote: > Ok. You all are getting pretty good at this. Let's try another one. > > http://www.geocities.com/michaelanicole33/Morestuff.html > > Tim > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. > For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, > email apisto-request@listbox.com. apisto-digest@listbox.com also available. > Web archives at http://lists.thekrib.com/apisto ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com. apisto-digest@listbox.com also available. Web archives at http://lists.thekrib.com/apisto