Rams/White spots; Belly sliders

["Maladorno, Dionigi \(DRUG;Nutley\)" <DIONIGI.MALADORNO@roche.com>]

 Lilia Stepanova <ls691035@bcm.tmc.edu>
wrote: <<<<<Subject: Re: A. cruzi? + Any cure for sick rams?
I dont think it is temperature (was 80-81 F and rams had regularly 
spawned. Ammonia idea is possible, but it was not HUGE amount of food, 
and neons always picked up everything left, even with the danger of 
self-combustion. And here is still link to BS. May be, somehow BS
results 
in more ammonia/nitrites. >>>>>>

Even if other fishes eat the food leftovers (BS or anything else with
protein content) , you still get increased ammonia production = stress =
increased susceptibility to infections.


In addition to Ich, whitish spots may be caused by velvet (Oodinium),
and differentiate the two may sometimes be difficult. Velvet is more
heat tolerant than Ich, and 80-81 deg. F are certainly not adequate to
prevent it.

Untergasser's books ( in particular: D. Untergasser (1989). Handbook of
Fish Diseases. TFH, Neptune, NJ, U.S.A, which in my opinion should be
owned and studied by every hobbyist who has access to it, since it will
pay itself in saved fish and avoided frustrations) suggests the
following:

Ich: 30 deg. C ( 86 F) for 10 days

Costia (not a cause of small white spots, though): 32 deg. C (90F) for
four days

Velvet: 34 deg. C (93 F) for 24-36 hours


When warmer, the water needs to be aerated to compensate for the oxygen
loss. Several fishes may not tolerate the higher temps , especially if
already debilitated by the disease. Formalin+malachite green is an
alternative. Rams have the reputation to like warm water, but I have no
direct experience with them above 86 deg. F.  Maybe other list members
could share their experience with dwarf cichlids at temps above 90 F: I
would be very interested in learning more. I know that discus take it
with no problems, while corys and tetras often die after a few days.





Another subject: Bob (is it you?) asked to share experience on "belly
sliders":

My experience is limited to the following:

One brood of Laetacara curviceps (none)

Two broods of A. maciliensis (none)

One brood of A. staecki (probably one or two individuals)

Two broods of A. cacatuoides (10% in one, too early to tell in the
other)

Symproms: "corkscrew" swimming, laying at the bottom, sometimes muscular
contraction with bent spine which may suggest neurological involvement.

It's definitely a problem: thinking at the possibility of a bacterial
neurological or swimbladder infection (I have never seen around data
proving conclusively that it's an organ development problem, although
this may certainly be true) I tried once to use the Tetra medicated
flakes for parasites (my belly sliders seemed still able to eat in the
initial stages), without any very evident response. Maybe I will try
again in this new batch of A. cacatuoides fry I have, still at the stage
when it's hard to detect the problem.


Dionigi Maladorno