Ken, No, they are not. A. sp. Mamoré is a separate, but scientifically undescribed, species. All 3 members of the trifasciata-group (A. trifasciata, A. maciliensis, & A. sp. Mamoré) can be found in the Rio Mamoré/Guaporé drainage, but so far are not known to be sympatric (found together). This shouldn't be too surprising if, as I suspect, the trifasciata-group is an offshoot of the cacatuoides-complex of the cacatuoides-group. There are cacatuoides-complex fish (A. luelingi, A. sp. Guaporé, and A. staecki) found in the lower Rio Guaporé drainage. The true A. trifasciata is found in the upper reaches of the Rio Guaporé close to streams entering the Rio Paraguay drainage. Apparently A. trifasciata entered the the Rio Paraguay system via stream piracy or through the Pantanal swamps during periods of high water. A. trifasciata can be ID'd from other members of the trifasciata-group by the highly visible diagonal band between the pectoral fin insertion and the anus. It can have either a clear tail or a series of pale, fine spots on the caudal fin. A. maciliensis occurs in the middle reaches of the Rio Guaporé above the mouth of the Rio Mamoré. It can be ID'd by having either a pale & irregular, or no diagonal band and a broad yellow area (band) above the dark lateral band. Its tail fin is supposed to be unspotted. A. sp. Mamoré comes from the Rio Mamoré. It is distinguished from the others by having a much broader lateral band that frequently is missing on the anterior (front) part of the body. The diagonal band is always missing in this species. On most species there is also a metallic red spot located just behind the opercular (gill plate) opening in front of the pelvic fin insertion. The fish called A. trifasciata maciliensis in the Mayland & Bork book is actually A. sp. Mamoré. commonly the tail is finely spotted. If anyone has any other ways to ID these 3 species, or if I'm in anyway wrong, I'd really like to hear from you. Mike Wise Ken Laidlaw wrote: > Mike, > Thanks for the info, very interesting. > > On the maciliensis, is this the same as A. sp mamore? I > think I read somewhere on the list before that they were > one and the same. > > Regards, > Ken. > > > Yes, I use Dr. Kullander's list for the most part. Since his list is usually a bit > > dated, I add to it. For example, the last time I checked he still had A. maciliensis as > > a part of A. trifasciata. He now considers it a separate species, > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@majordomo.pobox.com. > For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, > email apisto-request@majordomo.pobox.com. > Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"! ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@majordomo.pobox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@majordomo.pobox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!