I have been following this discussion with interest and thought I would throw my 2 cents in. Sounds like you are on the right track Cory. I like the fact that you are providing a environment that makes the fish feel secure! ie: floating plants, java moss. This is providing cover which they need to feel secure. It's kind of like the hierachy of needs they wont spawn if they dont feel secure. Your feeding regime seems excellent as well. Given that those things are being done correctly it's only a matter of time before the female fills with spawn and simply will have to do what comes naturally! However givung them water that is very low in DOC/ Low Microsiemens will speed things up tremoedously. In nature the rainy season is very often a biological signal to our fish to spawn. Their is an increase in food, and an influx of very soft water due to the heavy rains. In an aquarium even though we may have the very best filter system it will not remove organic impurities such as nitrate and many other Dissolved organics. This can be very easily seen when one tests the water of an R.O. system for the counductivity and them after fish are added it very often jumps dramiticly and at an exponential rate. When we look at the microsiemens of water in the rivers of South America, the black water rivers in particuler, we very often find a counductivity of 10 us/cm! For the fish in question this is in fact the case. Given the fact that our fish are so flexable and do tolerate and spawn at less then ideal conditions speaks volumes at the ease in which many species will spawn. My point is perhaps a few more water changes, perhaps 50% week, may do the trick. There is a myth that to big a water change will hurt your fish and obviuosly when it comes to our dwarfs this is a farce. Please keep in mind I beleive your fish will spawn at the conditions you are providing given time but since you seem like you would like to speed things up I can tell you this has worked for me for years. Good luck with your fish and hopefully very soon you can share your story of a shoal of fry swimming around with their momma! ===== David Sanchez Orlando, FL http://www.mindspring.com/~barbax barbax@mindspring.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!