Re: Uggggh!

[krandall@world.std.com]

At 04:37 PM 7/19/99 -0500, James wrote:

>George, and everyone else.... one reason why I keep trying to push and shove
>is that while (almost) everyone seems to be reaching a common concencus on
>some major issues, almost everyone is also suggesting slanting/rigging the
>Judging to favour planted tanks. I think doing that, if accepted as one of
>our "guiding principles" is going to lead to MAJOR problems down the road,
>and I don't really think that everyone has thought it through and can offer
>a simple way of doing it.

That is _not_ what I'm suggesting.  I _do_ suggest that we decide what
types of entries are allowable. (IMO, any clear fronted container of
freshwater (include brackish if you want))  Once THAT issue is decided, we
can work on judging standards. (If you want my opinions on that, I have
some, but didn't think this was the time)

>Coming up with comprehensive and fair judging guidelines is going to be
>hairy enough without introducing the extra burden of building in a "slant"
>to favour plant tanks.

I agree completely.  What are we afraid of?  Do we really feel the need to
skew juding to favor our tanks?  I don't think so.

>That's one side.... now lets look at the other....

>I've already covered, and CLOSED, the issue of AGA involvement in this. I
>realize that only a small minority of people here may actually be AGA
>members but everyone has to realize that there MIGHT be some point beyond
>which the AGA MC is not willing to stretch their probably limited resources.

Now, wearing my AGA hat, I suggest that you think big.  If the AGA MC
doesn't think they can handle it, let _them_ tell you.

>To quote from the AGA website, the organization's stated Purpose is:
>
>- to disseminate information about aquatic plants.
>- to study and improve upon techniques for culturing aquatic and bog plants
>in aquariums and ponds.
>- to increase interest in aquatic gardening.
>- to promote fellowship among its members.
>

First, in regards to our "AGA purpose", I would categorize this showcase as
falling under:

- to increase interest in aquatic gardening.
- to promote fellowship among its members.

We can't educate people until we capture their interest.  What better forum?

>Now, I _tend_ to agree with Olga that it is a stretch, for me as an AGA
>member, to see them getting very interested in a contest which even had a
>possibility where a non-planted tank could take first prize.
>
>I _can_ see them being interested in an event open to aquatic gardeners for
>judging  and all other aquascapers as a showcase only.

Do you think we're really that insecure?  I'm not.  I _hope_ that the rest
of the MC isn't either, let alone the rest of our membership.  Let's show
'em our stuff! (In our BAS Home Show "Master's" division, planted tanks
complete head to head with reef tanks.  The planted tanks hold their own
_very_ nicely, thank you ;-)

>On the _third_ hand.... (I'm Canadian, and there is a lot of in-breeding up
>here....)...

A third hand comes in very handy when planting out those Glossostigma lawns ;-)

>But as I read over the messages which have just been posted by George and
>Justin, maybe I am wrong in thinking that it is even going to be _possible_
>to draw a line in the laterite as to "what" constitutes a "planted tank".
>Maybe it _should_ be wide open. I just want everyone to think about the
>consequences of their choices BEFORE we set anything in stone.

See?  I should have just kept reading and not posting.  It seems like you
guys are all coming around to my point(s) of view with out me.  Thank God,
you DON'T need a "mother"!<g>

>But I still don't like "slanting" the judging... it is patently unfair...

James, you wanted us to stick to the agenda.  Let's do it.  YOU won't, and
I won't, in the end, allow an unfair competition to develop. 

Let's cross the bridge of judging guidelines when we come to it.  (Just for
kicks, it might be fun to have the input of the people we choose to be
judges on _that_ issue)

>Shit! The longer I think about this, the more I'm convinced that we should
>open it up to everyone, leave it up to them to decide if they want their
>tanks judged or just showcased via a checkbox on the entry form, and get a
>group of FAIR, COMPETENT Judges to decide what looks best.
>
>(Karen is going to have a bird when she gets back and reads all of
>this.....)

Well, I'm thinking that Kathleen's gonna call me tomorrow looking for my
column, and I've spent all afternoon, reading and responding to this stuff,
only to see that you figured out the answer by yourselves. ;-)

Karen
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