For my 2 cents, I find that my Apistos do better when I crowd them a bit. I do have to work hard to make sure that good water quality is maintained, and although having a lot of plants helps, water changes are key. In my 55 gallon tank I keep 8 juvenile rams with a pair of A. "papagei", and 6 Cory cats. The rams and Apistos flare at each other, and there is some chasing, but the agression seems to spread out to the point where no one gets hurt and everyone gets a chance to eat. In my 40 gallon tank I have 6 juvenile A. trifasciata (from D. Soares) 3 males, 3 females, with 6 Cories, and 12 Nannostomus beckfordii 4 males, 8 females. Yes, this is a VERY crowded tank, but the Apistos are healthier and more active than they ever were when I kept them in pairs in their own tanks. Anyway, just my opinion. Patricia ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com. apisto-digest@listbox.com also available. Web archives at http://lists.thekrib.com/apisto