hi Collin, a few years ago i got to meet W. Staeck at a cichlid conference in France who advised me to use beech leaves. As you say, I imagine that different species of oak leaves will have slightly different properties. I use the big leaves species growing throughout France without any problem. I haven't tried yet the species growing in Oregon as they are different from that i use to use in the past.. I may try though! have a great week Yvan Alleau 712 NW Kings Blvd Corvallis, OR 97330 College of Oceanic and Atmospheric Sciences Oregon State University office (Burt 222): 737-3649, to be used wisely! home: 738-0606 PLEASE NOTE NEW E-MAIL ADDRESS: yalleau@coas.oregonstate.edu "When you're far from everything, you're getting closer to the essential" -----Original Message----- From: owner-apisto@admin.listbox.com [mailto:owner-apisto@admin.listbox.com]On Behalf Of Colin Gorton Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 1:47 AM To: apisto@listbox.com Subject: Leaves I know that the theory goes that oak (or beech) leaves can act in a smilar way to peat, my question is whether there are any other alternatives. I CAN get oak leaves but I'm not sure whether species is important or not. As you may know, there are many different species of oak and I suspect the ones that we know of for our fish are those species that grow in temperate zones. My worry is that the forms available to me in Spain may not work in the same way. So, can I use chestnut, plain tree or any other leaves instead of oak or beech? The three mentioned above are the most readily available to me. BTW the main reason for wanting to put leaves in my tanks is not for the acidifying properties but as cover for my fish. Acidifying is better but I'm not too concerned other than that I don't poison my fish. -- _______________________________________________ Get your free email from http://www.graffiti.net Powered by Outblaze ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com. apisto-digest@listbox.com also available. Web archives at http://lists.thekrib.com/apisto Trading at http://blox.dropship.org/mailman/listinfo/apisto_trader ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com. apisto-digest@listbox.com also available. Web archives at http://lists.thekrib.com/apisto Trading at http://blox.dropship.org/mailman/listinfo/apisto_trader