[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]

Re: spawning?

Folks, I am really glad this thread of spawning behavior has held up and the
"flames" of hell have been avoided.  This is the kind of discussion that we
should feel free to have.....a discussion of experiences.  The last time
this topic was tried....well!

Can I get in here a bit.  Most of you know which side I'm on here...doesn't
make me right, just my experiences...I don't believe we have created angels
and other fish that won't raise their fry or apisto's that won't raise their
fry.  I don't think we can undo 10000000000000 years of natural selection
and habits in 3-4-5 generations of in breeding.  The question is, I think,
do we know REALLY what these little buggers are like in the wild?  Oh we
have guesses, there is undoubtedly a great deal of parental care but really
how much???  I've talked at length with 5 people personally, and at length,
who have been to ALL parts of the Amazon basin collecting apisto and etc.
and not a one of those guys ever saw a female or a FEMALE AND MALE with a
bunch of young (I didn't say it doesn't happen).  I know that there are good
times to go collecting ....the rainy season and all of that...but I think
there are too many unanswered questions to assume we know all of the answers
about apisto parental behavior because we watched them in an
aquarium......we can only talk of our experiences......not talk about who is
WRONG!  Maybe none of us are WRONG or entirely right...including me (I can
only talk of my experiences) but to generalize my experience as the only
fact there must be is a bit out of line I think.

One thing for sure however...when they find these apistos generally they
find a bunch of them in the leaf litter evidently.  It's been described to
me as "...in one SQUARE foot of leave litter there may be 40-50 apistos.
Thus you have heard the famous story of David Soares' tank of apistos...a 55
gallon with some 150-175 cacatuoides in there...it's true, and I would dare
say that not a whole bunch of us have tried to sit and watch the dynamics of
a tank like that!  So I took a part of that thinking and put it to this
.......small, but effective so far.... experiment.  Vinny Kutty gave me
about 30-40 pair of VERY YOUNG wild (F0) A. agassizii he had caught and
brought back......emphasis F0's (this was my opportunity).  I took most of
them to our club and auctioned them off as I was directed but I ended up
"cherry" picking about 5-6 males and about 8-9 females and the ALL ended up
in a 20 gallon long...a 20 gall long (crowded tank) with enough PVC tubes
and  PVC couplings to choke a horse (hiding places...all fish were
reasonably comfortable...tension but comfortable).  That tank is probably
the most interesting tank I have to simply sit and watch the interaction.
But when the sizes got a little larger (you couldn't sex them when Vinny
first brought them...they were really young) and their first spawnings
began, all kinds of things happened.  Some spawns were good, some spawns
were eaten some spawns just never hatched some spawns ended up with 2-3
young that eventually became mature and some hatches the female was good
enough to actually get 20-25 of those young to 5-6 weeks until I pulled
them.  All of this spawning behavior happened at the same time in the SAME
water conditions.  Water quality CERTAINLY has a lot to do with trying to
spawn these nifty apistos, and we must strive to get the best water quality
we can to these fish to even try to observe "normal" behavior but let's
don't be too sure we know all of the other action or reactions of these
fish...behaviors.  ONLY through giving our experiences and LISTENING and
INTERACTING to others experiences will we eventually really learn someday
the real trick....OK Flame away, tell me again I am wrong.

I'm sorry I got so wound up, but these types of conversations should be able
to happen without fear of someone telling someone else they are wrong...it
tend to stifle a conversation.

Hey.........everyone have a great day.  And by the way...at the next ACA
convention, lets have a "FOR REAL APISTO DISCUSSION".  I know a bunch of you
were their but I only recognized and met Bob Dixon and Julio Melgar.  Even
if we only just meet informally somewhere..........what do you think!


Mike Jacobs
Center for Advanced Technologies
Lakewood H.S.
St Pete, Fl  33705

This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com.
For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help,
email apisto-request@listbox.com.
Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!