Mike and Vinny, I went down to the lfs to get more info on collection locale last night and it seem to be a very isolated area about 250 miles south of Puerto Ayhacucho or about 150 miles north of the Brazilan Border, They rented a bush plane just to get there. The fish were on a mountain side in a small stream that feeds into the Orinoco. On the map I saw there was the name La Esmerlada, not sure if it is a town or not. I dont know the water parameters, but from that area I would guess clear water, 0 hardness, fairly acidic. Also caught there were some A. sp. red wedge. I got a female, now I gotta go back and get a male. I tend to agree with Mike Wise on the I.D. except that the male has a very, very yellow underside. They dont seem to like light much. During the day the male harrasses the two females to no end, at night when the light goes out the females flare at each other a lot and the male hides. Any Ideas? Thanks yall Tim ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@majordomo.pobox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@majordomo.pobox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!